Episode 487: BIG Dental Decisions + Team Impacts

Dr. Paul Goodman — Dr. Nacho himself — is back on the podcast! He talks with Kiera about the four big decisions dentists make (first job, buying a practice, hiring first associate, and selling practice) and how they impact team members. There’s talk of transitions, having uncomfortable conversations, the normalcy of friction (but not toxicity), and becoming a word ninja.

This episode is all about changing the game of dentistry ... for the better.

More on Dr. Goodman

While chief dental resident during his general practice residency and hospital fellowship at Albert Einstein Medical Center, Dr. Goodman received advanced training and also placed and restored 150 dental implants. He has been a faculty member for Hiossen Dental Implant Training Program for the past 10 years and has helped over 100 general dentists place their first dental implants. Additionally, he teaches dental residents at Albert Einstein Medical Center, lecturing to dentists on placing and restoring implants.

A graduate of the University of Pennsylvania School of Dental Medicine, Dr. Goodman has been practicing dentistry for over 10 years and works with his brother in two locations in Mercer County, NJ. Dr. Goodman has purchased three dental practices and shares his personal experience with retiring dentists in managing the expectations of their patients and team members during the transition process. He is the founder of Rising Dentists Study Club and Rittenhouse Consulting, LLC – both in Philadelphia.

Episode resources:

Chew on some Dental Nachos

Listen to episode 72, Dentist-ing in 2019

Listen to episode 65, This Dental Decision is MORE Important Than Who You Marry

Reach out to Kiera

Subscribe to the Dental A-Team podcast 

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0:00:05.6 Kiera Dent: Hey everyone, welcome to the Dental A Team Podcast. I'm your host Kiera Dent, and I have this crazy idea that maybe I could combine a doctor and a team member's perspective, because let's face it, dentistry can be a challenging profession with those two perspectives. I've been a dental assistant, treatment coordinator, scheduler, filler, office manager, regional manager, practice owner, and I have a team of travelling consultants, for we have travelled over 165 different offices coaching teams. Yep, we don't just understand you, we are you. Our mission is to positively impact the world of dental, and I believe that this podcast is the greatest way I can help elevate teams, grow VIP experiences, reduce stress and create A teams. Welcome to the Dental A Team Podcast.


0:00:51.3 KD: Hello, Dental A team listeners, this is Kiera, and you guys, today I'm excited to bring on one of my dear friends. You guys probably know him, and if you don't know him, you must know him. He speaks at our summit, he's a ton of fun. He and I just hang out, have a good time. Dr. Paul Goodman Nacho. Dr. Nacho's what he's known as. Dr. Paul Goodman, super jazzed to have you. How are you today, Paul?

0:01:13.3 Paul Goodman: I'm doing great Kiera. I always love talking to you, you have great energy. I love what you do for the dental world. I think one of the things, I think of Kiera Dent makes things more fun, must be fun. And I really love that. Life, dentistry, especially over the past couple of years, we realised that embrace fun when you can get it, and I love that about you.

0:01:29.0 KD: Amen, well, thank you. And that's good to know because our number one core value is actually fun, so I'm happy to know I bring the fun that people feel fun. And I feel the same way about you Paul, we have a good time. I love your Nachos, I was literally...

0:01:40.0 PG: Thanks.

0:01:40.1 KD: Wearing you guys' sweatshirt swag last night.

0:01:43.0 PG: Nice.

0:01:43.3 KD: Pennington dental and Dental Nachos...

0:01:45.1 PG: Awesome.

0:01:45.2 KD: I've got a lot of it so... Paul, for those of you who may not know you, you are a practicing dentist. It's funny a lot of your team that now is joining your Nachos side, they're like, I don't even think of Paul as a dentist.

0:01:55.6 PG: Right.

0:01:55.6 KD: And am like, no, he is a dentist, and we just... Britt was actually out at your brother, like it's both of your practices, but was just out at your practice, raving fans there, you guys do great things there, but just kinda tell people the listeners if they haven't heard of Dr. Nacho himself, just kind of your background and how you became Dr. Nacho.

0:02:13.0 PG: Sure. I always like the movie scare when it kinda starts now and goes back to the beginning.

0:02:18.2 KD: Right.

0:02:18.4 PG: So currently, I work one to two days a week in the dental office. I do work like eight out of seven days a week doing Dental Nachos, dentist job connect, transitions brokering. I love what I've created. I'm totally responsible for all the intensity I've created, which is what we call stress, we don't call it stress in our world, we say we call it intensity. So I love that I've created the ability to not have to be in the dental operatory all the time, but still really enjoy it. I am a parent to a three and a seven-year-old, have an amazing wife. I don't think this fits exactly the same way with parenting, but if you only had to watch your three-year-old, two out of seven days a week, you'd be like, "Man, this is not as bad," right? Kind of like a grandparent or aunt, so I'm more of like, I'm a practice owner, but we have associates in our practice, prosthodontist, periodontist, my brother is an awesome general dentist, other general dental associates.

0:03:06.9 PG: So if anyone's listening and wanna expand what they do, you have to be able to replace yourself at your dental office first. So I worked really, really, really, really hard for like 15 years. Kiera what I think is cool about social media, but also funny to me is, I didn't just pop up in 2017 from a Nacho patch like a Cabbage Patch Kid. I was a practicing dentist, implant speaker, obviously been a transitions broker before that. So I was doing traditional, prior to that I did a multiple year general practice residency in 2002 at Albert Einstein. That was a huge, awesome thing for me. I learned how to place implants, restore implants, it's been a cornerstone of what I like to do in my practice. I don't place implants anymore, we have specialists there, but that was a... If anyone's listening and they're thinking, I wanna learn more about implants, I say, do it. It's one of the only things Kiera that we're gonna do more of.

0:03:54.2 KD: Definitely.

0:03:54.2 PG: If you think about it, people are not gonna need more fillings as simple as that. We've done it, people do not need 20 fillings most of the time. RPDs same thing, but with implants and people living longer, we get this awesome opportunity, I call them bionic shark teeth. I say lucky we've invented Milly bionic shark teeth, so now that you've fractured, broken the base part of your number 30 that's been in for 62 years Milly, right?


0:04:20.5 PG: Which is 62,000 meals. I know you've been in a dental office for a long time Kiera before you did this. Dentists are so negative because dental school teaches to be negative, so the next time someone's crown needs to be replaced, don't get all sad about it. Say that lasted 12 years, that's 12,000 meals. We eat 1000 meals a year. And I think patients will reframe the positivity there so...

0:04:41.2 KD: Totally, I love it. [laughter]

0:04:43.7 PG: That was a huge part of my life being a General Practice Resident, Chief Resident at Einstein. Learned to place and restore implants. After that I worked with my dad and his partner. Before my brother was a dentist, we bought a second practice, we've merged practices in. I've always liked to be part of a team, sometimes it's totally Nacho nuts to have a periodontist, a prosthodontist, multiple associates, but I love it. It's for me. I think my associate was just emailing me about a patient he saw of mine that has an over-denture, she says the implant has a little recession, which we do. I write back, I really like that camaraderie.

0:05:14.2 KD: Right.

0:05:14.3 PG: So you guys are the A team, I guess we're the Nacho team, both in our dental practice life and outside of that. So then Dental Nachos, I created a group that I thought we would talk about implants and practice management in 2017. 2017 due to this pandemic seems like it was 50 years [laughter] ago and five minutes ago, right? So for me, I thought I'd create this small group like to be 1000 people, we could share ideas, and then it's turned into this fun Frankenstein where Dental Nachos now has like over 38,000 members. We also have online communities on Instagram, through text, through email, and my goal is to try to bond dentist together. When you're wearing Nachos swag, you must know the answer to, hey, what's Dental Nachos? Because my trainer gets that question, dental students get that question, my patients get the question. And I'd say it's like a Mr. Rogers neighbourhood for dentists. Dentists needs to re-learn how to be nice to each other and work on their businesses. And that's the way I describe it.

0:06:11.9 KD: I totally agree, and Paul I love what you do, because between you and me, I say, we're a good peanut butter and jelly. You say Nachos so I'll be your nachos toppings to your chips. You take the dentist side of it, we take the team side of it. And that's something I love because when you speak at our summits, I love that you bring... Last year, you had such a killer topic. People loved it, they raved about it.

0:06:32.8 PG: Oh, thanks.

0:06:32.8 KD: Yeah, totally. Because you talked about, doctors, you gotta be ready to bring on an associate. And I love what you said. You said, "Dentists, if you're not ready to make less money, don't bring on an associate." And I remembering being like, Paul dropped the mic. I'm so proud of you. Thanks for saying it. But also, you come in and you bring the positivity, 'cause our goal is to positively impact the world of dentistry in the greatest way possible. And I feel like you're on the exact same mission. You come from the dentist side, we come from the team side. Because I agree, there's so much negativity that can be around us if we choose to embrace it. And you and I are both like, record scratch. There's actually this whole world of positivity. Let's all be friends. So, Paul, today, I know we wanted to kinda chat about something that I love that you're passionate about of the four biggest decisions that dentists make, and how they impact their teams. Yes, Paul. Here we go. Let's bring home the peanut butter and jelly. Let's bring home the nachos and toppings. Let's do this.

0:07:24.1 PG: Through the past couple years, I've really focused on helping dentists find their first job. Even prior to Dental Nachos, I was doing this on Dental Town, I was doing this with my residents. So finding your first job. Just did a great podcast with Rob Montgomery today, and I said, "They say there's two certainties in life. Death and taxes." But I said, "There's a third certainty. When you finish dental school and you've invested $500,000, you're gonna need a job." So you need a job after your dental school residency. So we help dentists find their first job that's the right fit for them. Then the biggest decision of a person's career, I will argue life, I'll tell you why in a second. Some of these things come with a lot of emotional parts and poignancy, but buying a dental practice. So I'm someone who helps dentists sell their dental practice. So I go in and meet with them at the end of their lives, the end of their career in the most poignant way through some life events that they had no control over, some they may have. They've had multiple spouses, multiple houses, their family may not talk to them, they may [0:08:22.6] ____ but they still have that same first dental practice.

0:08:26.3 PG: And that's not to be negative, it's just to share that if you buy a dental practice at age 30, that dental practice may be with you at age 60 or 65. So making the right choice for you is important. Hiring your first associate, my hope is that there's room for success for a lot of creative business models in dentistry. So while DSOs are a thing and solo practitioners are a thing, what I would love to see more of is simply a solo practitioner hiring an associate, mentoring someone, getting some time off, maybe it's part-time. So I help them hire their first associate, learn if they're ready, and then finally sell their practice and hang up the hand piece, the hygienist, maybe they hang up the scaler, but hang up the... So there's the four biggest decisions. Job, buy, hire, sell.

0:09:11.0 KD: I love it. And you're right. It's so many pieces that I don't think people realise. I tell everybody, I'm like, "Hey, dentists, figure out where you actually wanna be long-term before you buy that practice," because unlike myself and you now, Paul, we can pick up and move, and we can run... I could run Dental A Team anywhere in the world. You theoretically could run Dental Nachos anywhere in the world.

0:09:32.8 PG: Right.

0:09:33.3 KD: There are more virtual companies. We could hire team members in those areas, we could have them virtual. I know you've got team members all across the nation. I do too. But as a practicing dentist, you can't pick up your patient base and...

0:09:45.0 PG: For sure.

0:09:45.3 KD: Transfer them or virtually meet them. It's really an important decision. So I'm excited to hear what you think are those four biggest decisions that dentists make and how they actually impact their teams, 'cause I'm all about teams, helping those team members rise and thrive. I realised there was a niche out there that everybody focuses on the dentist. What about those team members? Let's elevate them up. So, excited to kinda hear what you've seen.

0:10:07.5 PG: That's why I'm really excited to share more about this with your audience, is that your team is like a family. And I wanna say this in the most genuine way, families fight a lot, and families have friction. So people are like, "I treat my team like family." I'm like, "Oh, when you're on vacation at the beach, do you guys argue over where to order the food?" And that's normal, right? Friction's normal, toxicity is not. Not for this podcast, but I wanna do some work on this, because what's friction and what's normal? What's toxicity, what's not normal? Let's just take the normal friction part of an office. If you brought a puppy into a dental office, the whole team wouldn't necessarily love it. Someone would say, "I wanted a different puppy. How come we didn't get a cat? I wanted an iguana. I'm allergic to dogs." So let's talk about hiring an associate. The practice owner should really have good conversations with the team, such as, "Do you think it would be good for us to have an associate?" And maybe sometimes their office manager or their hygienist should say, "Dr. Smith, you get upset if we change the blue pens to light blue pens." So I'm not so sure if you're the type of person who's ready to give up control of your patient care.

0:11:13.3 PG: On the other side here, the team might say, "You know what? We would love for you to have an associate. You've been working five days a week, you're 55 years old. This is the time. Take a day off a week. It doesn't matter if you make less money." So those are the decisions that impact the team. And I just think... I talk about FUCs, Kiera, but I was on another podcast. So life is a lot about FUCs, friendly, uncomfortable conversations. They can be friendly, and they can be uncomfortable. One of the things I would love to change long-term in a better way is more authentic discussions about selling your practice. What I think is crazy, Kiera, is every team knows their dentist is gonna retire one day, right?

0:11:51.4 KD: Totally.

0:11:52.2 PG: But they hide it like it's some big shock. We were... Jeff and I bought a practice from this awesome guy, small practice in his house. Made like $120,000 a year. We bought the patients, we sent out letters. Guy was so nice. Such a nice guy. His patients came to see Jeff and I for the first time. And someone said, "I can't believe Dr. T abandoned me." I go, "Abandoned you? Did you see how old he was at your last recall? Let the poor guy go to the beach, right?"

0:12:20.8 KD: Right.

0:12:21.3 PG: Like, "Let him move on. He went to the beach with his wife." So what I think, the team should be involved in friendly uncomfortable conversations. Not ones that are dramatic, but, "Hey, I'm 55 years old. I see myself transitioning out of dentistry over the next 5-10 years. Maybe we get an associate now, and that's longer." And then you have to be willing... See, dentists are... People are this way too, and it's not [0:12:43.9] ____. They kinda fear something going wrong, and they don't see what goes right. That's not my quote. I've seen that probably... It's like, if you talk with eight people and say, "Hey, I might sell this practice in the next five years so I can move to Arizona, but what I wanna make sure is we have a good transition plan, and we make sure the office is great and I look for someone to take over, DSO." If one person quits, Kiera, they're not the right team member for you anyway.

0:13:07.5 KD: Totally, totally. Yeah. I think it's just that awkward... My favourite thing is understanding that the only time frustration occurs is when expectations aren't met, and so by that, if there's the expectation... People told me, I remember I had a girl quit on me 'cause she overheard me chatting with my business coach, which was no secret, but she quit 'cause she's like, "Yeah, Kiera, I heard that you might wanna sell this company one day," and I'm like, yeah, like record, scratch on that. Of course I do, I should be building this company, all of us are always building this company to sell it, because then it's actually a company. It's not just some hodgepodge mess over here.

0:13:43.1 PG: Right.

0:13:44.3 KD: There is... And if you're uncomfortable with that, by all means, there are other dream jobs for you and please by all means have that. So I really love that you talked about it, like there is that... I think it's just that surprise and being a buyer, I've been a buyer of many practices, and it is really, really, really this hush-hush, don't say anything, don't let the team know, and then they come on board and then it's this mayhem and people are ticked off and you're trying to smooth things over, and it's like, wow, glad I kept the team intact, but none of them like us.

0:14:14.6 PG: Right, yeah. It has the unintended consequences of anger. There's no perfect way to do this. As a transition's broker, people say, when do I tell my team? Well, I say, first of all, just so I can add some value here, don't do this. If I say to my three-year-old, "We might get ice cream," every five minutes is, "Are we getting ice cream now? Are we getting ice cream now?" So what I do caution to do is, if you were to talk to a dental practice broker about selling your practice in the next two years, don't go and say, "I signed up to sell our practice," because every day your team is gonna be like, "Are we selling it today? Are we selling it today?" It's figuring out the right timing, but I think introducing the concept of understanding the circle of dentisting like I talk about.

0:14:51.2 PG: I mean dentistries are very confusing. There might be a front desk team member who thinks the dentist works till 80, and this 50-year-old is thinking they wanna be done in five years, so just having conversations and also over this pandemic and I've seen it. It's happened to me personally. Life happens, people die suddenly, people get injured, people have family problems, so you should be looking to have a transition plan in place even when you don't need it. One of my lectures was, why you need to learn how to sell your practice before you need to sell your practice.

0:15:21.3 KD: So true.

0:15:21.8 PG: And you probably have seen those things yourself with your team.

0:15:24.0 KD: Yeah.

0:15:25.4 PG: With the practices you coach.


0:15:28.2 KD: Hey, Dental A team listeners, did you guys know that I think everything in life is better with a buddy. That's right, I've been trying to learn to work out for 2022, it's been way easier to have Shelby and Brittany and Dana join me. It's always better with a buddy, so that's why for Valentine's Day, we want you guys to share the love. So for Dental A team's virtual summit on April 22nd through 23rd, we're having a buy one, get one this week only. That's right. It's better with a buddy. So make sure you go buy one ticket, you get to bring a buddy with you for free, so head on over to thedentalateam.com, use coupon code "Better With A Buddy." That's right, "Better With A Buddy" and be sure to get your buy one, get one. I can't wait to see you guys at our summit. It's the year to optimise and execute. We're gonna teach you how to optimise every department of your practice and give you massive leadership so you can execute consistently. I can't wait to see you. Head on over to thedentalateam.com, use coupon code "Better With A Buddy," and I'll see you soon.


0:16:29.3 KD: 100%. I think it's brilliant, and I really do love that you talked about this of involving your team in these decisions, but like you also said, sequence matters.

0:16:38.6 PG: Right.

0:16:38.7 KD: And I don't think there's a... It's not worth raising the roost and making the whole team freak out, but I also think I should like speaking to the team side of this, team members realise your dentist will transition. Your doctor will retire at some point, and it might be sooner than you're expecting, and that doesn't mean it's bad or wrong. I've had Brittany who actually went to your practice, her practice sold to a DSO, and she said it was one of the best things that ever happened. So I think we've got this fear...

0:17:04.0 PG: That's awesome.

0:17:04.6 KD: Just like patients have fear. There are some dentists who are not great to go to. There are also dentists who are amazing to go to, and so just because you hear DSO or we're selling, does not mean it has to be a negative experience.

0:17:17.7 PG: Oh, I love it.

0:17:18.2 KD: It can actually be a really positive and maybe looking for mentors or people who have had great experiences and asking them, "Why was it so good? What made it so good?" That way you can have a better experience rather than a negative one.

0:17:31.2 PG: Totally agree, only add one thing 'cause you said something. I'm cautious about word choice, and as you grow up, I believe that I strive, I say strive instead of try. So I say, I strive not to say to my seven-year-old that she's shy because shy is kind of a negative word, right? So even though we said this growing up, we don't say shy as often. We say maybe slow to warm up because shy is kind of like a judgement, right? So I'm gonna say weird can be cool right? So I'm not gonna say weird's a bad word, but I will say, here's a unique thing about dentistry.

0:18:04.8 PG: The dentist is the most unique person in the practice, the team second most, and the patients are normal. They're the ones actually who are normal. We have the problem, the dentist and the team are the most unique, and when we make it weird and we make it awkward and we make it odd, our patients feel that. When we make it normal and we make it fun, and we make it like, "Hey, we just hired another new associate to replace an associate. We're so lucky to have Dr. Alicia here to share the joy of your mouth with another Dentist, Mrs. Smith." Who am I to deprive other dentists of learning how cool your teeth are? So when they say, why do I have to see a new dentist? Don't recoil and make it odd. Have an answer for that. Your verbal training is great. Jeff says all the time, what does... Like your dentist says, what does success look like? Those are the verbal tips, and I think being a verbal ninja and developing your verbal skills is key to, not just dental success, life success.

0:19:01.0 KD: Sure. I'm gonna ask the question, Paul, how did you take the spin to positivity? 'Cause I guarantee you maybe you've always been a positive guy, maybe you haven't, but I think so many people in the practices are like, cool, so Paul and Kiera talk like this. Truly, guys I didn't. My friend, one of my first people in my company that I hired. She was a dear friend of mine. She was like, Kiera, you need to be a better word ninja. So that was my word of like, "Be a word ninja." And I was like yeah, this is a great idea. How can I ninja this email? How can I ninja this experience? But that to me has been a good filter that I've had to put on of like, how can I make this experience great?

0:19:34.6 PG: I'll tell you exactly how it happened to me. A lot of it was a results-oriented, it wasn't necessarily so much internal positivity. I had a great mom who isn't alive anymore, my great dad, but I'm a human being. It's like when I was a restaurant server and I was new, I would come out and say, "Hey, Kiera, the chef forgot about your hamburger. It's gonna be a while," and then I realised that didn't help me with tips, that didn't help you with your experience, so I would say... I wouldn't lie, but I would say, "Hey, Kiera, the chef is taking special time to make sure your meal's right. Can I get you a free drink or dessert in the meantime?" So being a restaurant server taught me to be a verbal ninja, focus on the positive.

0:20:12.3 PG: I also did not like the dental school environment of constantly focusing on the negative. I didn't understand why we talked about failure and hopeless and terminal dentition. We're helping people chew and smile with confidence. One of the things... I have plenty opportunities for improvement, which is what I call weaknesses. I say to my wife, "I don't have any weaknesses, I just have opportunities for improvement," but what people say about me in the dental office is, "I've never been around a dentist who tries to make it so much fun," and that's just because I like people. And like, I don't know. Someone comes in, their crown broke off, I'll be like, "Hey, good job, Milly. It lasted seven years. Let's get you a bionic shark tooth." Like don't do...

0:20:51.7 PG: But I actually believe this, Kiera, in the dental world, they're very uncomfortable talking about money, and they have a dysfunctional relationship with money, and I just say, "It's so great to get an implant and use it for 20 years and chew 20,000 times for $5,000. We're so lucky for that." So I think dental school does a terrible job of preparing dentists to talk to patients like people, and that's part of the problem.

0:21:16.7 KD: Totally. I love that you... I love that you brought that up, 'cause you're right. Dentists get all... So do team members, we get weird about money. I remember I was weird, I was like, "Oh, can they afford this?" Then I was like, "Hold on, this is awesome. My job is to help you create a solution, and we're gonna find a solution for you. You're gonna have this amazing smile, and I can't wait." I love that you said chew and smile with confidence, 'cause you're right. I think you're just putting this really cool spin on it, and I do think each team member can look at that. Like you said, with an associate coming on, it can be a negative, guys, absolutely, or it can be a positive, and I think of like putting on different colours of sunglasses, so I'm like, "Okay, if I put on red sunglasses and go look outside, the sky is gonna look different than if I put on blue sunglasses, or if I put on black sunglasses."

0:22:00.4 PG: Yeah.

0:22:01.2 KD: So I think, again, it's the same thing within your practice of, what filter do you wanna put on this? And if your filter is like, "Let's have this fun and let's serve our patients and make the best experience," well, then let's have that same filter for the associate. Let's have that same filter for transition then.

0:22:13.1 PG: I mean, I do this, Kiera. People can copy anything I do. I hope they add value. I literally walk into new... I do a ton of new patient consults with giant cases on people who have to remove all their teeth. It's a very conflict-oriented thing. So they come in, sometimes from other dentists, I see, we do a complementary panoramic x-ray and a consult, so I already see the pan, I already know we got a lot of problems. I walk in, I say, "Hey, Kiera, I know you are at your favourite place, the dentist, so I know nothing can be better than being here after this visit." And you smile, and I smile, and I say, "I'm Dr. Paul. What can I do to make you happier?" And that's just like, I'm just not... Don't do any of that dumb dental school stuff like, "What's your chief complaint?"

0:22:49.9 PG: Imagine you sat down at a party and you're like... You tell someone like, "What's the worst thing happening to you right now?" It's like, "I don't know. I'm fighting with my mother, my company is not doing well." So I just say, "What could I do to make you happier?" And I believe this, I say this, Kiera, maybe if I say it on a podcast, maybe someone will make this come true, I'm not... I don't have any judgement on the people who think they can manifest stuff in their life because I totally get that mindset, but I'm not saying it to manifest it. I'm saying it because I hope someone hears this maybe and says, "So I believe that they should hire me, the AD... Anyone who can get up a few million dollars, ADA, whatever, and we should have a Super Bowl commercial and they should star me because I'm a dentist." We could get an actor, but they're not gonna be good enough 'cause they don't know what it feels like to have people tell you...

0:23:32.9 KD: It's true.

0:23:33.3 KD: That they hate them, and I'm gonna saying, "Hey, everybody, my name is Dr. Paul Goodman. I'm a dentist. I just wanna ask you, are you enjoying the Super Bowl snacks you're eating? Well, I'm a dentist, and me and my team just help you eat, chew, and smile with confidence. Be nicer to us," and walk out.


0:23:48.7 PG: And I believe we would... And I wouldn't say it in an insulting way, I would say it in a way that makes people smile, 'cause I say that to my patients. And I think if we reframe that dentists and teams help people chew and smile with confidence, help them eat the food they wanna eat, and people should be kinder to us and people shouldn't tell us they hate us, and people shouldn't tell us, "I can't believe it's $150," we will change the game of how patients see us and change those four major decisions. The job, the practice purchase, the hire, the sell. Instead of approaching them with fear, negativity, and anxiety, I think we would approach them with more fun.

0:24:22.0 KD: Yeah, I love it. And I think, again, one thing I hope people are taking is dentists like you get to change this, you get to determine this. You as the dentist could actually set the culture and the tone of your practice. So if you're gloom and doom, your practice is gonna follow suit. If you're fun and enjoyment, they're going to look for it. I think of the example of Zappos, I remember they were like, "Our culture is, we will deliver anything," and they're like, "I want a pizza," then they're like, "And I'll get you a pizza."


0:24:48.0 PG: Yeah.

0:24:48.3 KD: It's such a cool culture, but that was from the top down. So Paul, I'm curious. You see hundreds of dentists, you guys work with thousands of dentists. I was just with Dental Nachos, it's a fun group of people. Are there any other tips that you see that dentists do consistently that if they might be able to change it, could help make a better team or a better practice? What are some of those things that you see on a consistent basis?

0:25:11.6 PG: It's a great question. What I would like to share is, we make treatment plans for patients, and they have phases, "Remove teeth, preserve bone, get healthy, make short-term dentures, dentures without implants, you're smiling, you're not chewing, then we're gonna rebuild your teeth with implants and snap and dentures." We make phases. I think dentists do not create treatment plans for each five years of success in their career, and I think they forget about their morale and overly focus on money, and money is not what makes people happy most of the time. So what I would share is, the errors that I see is, not creating treatment plans for your own success. Whenever I post on Dental Nachos, "Here's an x-ray, here's a tooth, what should we do?" They say, "We need to know more about the patient, we need to know if they're 50, we need to know about their medical history." So what they're saying is, we can't have a one-size-fits-all treatment plan, we need to customise it to our patients, which is accurate.

0:26:03.2 PG: You need to customise your own treatment plan for happiness for yourself, and I think in a sad way, in a poignant way and if I can be part of the solution, making it better, dentists either ignore or are unaware or are afraid to make these treatment plans for success for their family, their team, and themselves, and I just think they should hire the right team. "Get a great attorney, get a good accountant, look to connect in your community, ask people what they do. Don't be afraid about selling to a DSA, don't just sell to a DSA for no reason. Don't hire two associates because you feel busy." So that would be my advice. Create a treatment plan for your own happiness, and be purposeful about it.

0:26:37.7 KD: I love it. I especially love it right now 'cause to your point, I've been noticing... I was just on another podcast before our podcast tonight, and I said, it's interesting that through COVID, I think a pattern I'm starting to notice is that... And I don't know, Paul, if you're seeing this too, I think most of the dentists actually through COVID have been pretty successful. Luckily it hasn't been a huge tip. In 2020, most of my offices made more than they did in 2019, so it's been this steady uprise, so they're technically making more, most of them, if they're watching their overhead and their numbers. But what I'm noticing is their morale, and the... Almost like the COVID crank is taking the joy.

0:27:15.4 KD: So I'm like, "You're making more money, but your team's more frustrated, you're more frustrated and nobody's happy." So shifting that and realising, like you said, creating plans and goals. I really love that you mentioned that, because I do agree. So many just think like, "We're just gonna build it to this and I wanna make this much money," but it's like... But what's the reason why? What do you wanna do with that? What kind of a family are you going to have? And I also think, and I don't know how you feel, I think it's okay to shift that treatment plan as well. 'Cause sometimes you'll hit that...

0:27:42.7 PG: For sure.

0:27:42.8 KD: And you'll be like, "Oh, great. I thought I was gonna have this." But rebuilding that treatment plan. Work towards it and then build a bigger treatment plan or continually grow and not just necessarily for yourself, but also for your team. I will say, as a CEO and as a boss and hanging out with my team, truly the thing that brings me the most satisfaction is helping my team hit their goals. It's so fun to watch these people...

0:28:04.4 PG: Yeah, awesome.

0:28:04.9 KD: Crush it out of the park, so I love that, and I appreciate that.

0:28:06.8 PG: Yeah. I agree with you. I say, adjustments are part of life. Always be connecting, always be caring, but always be creative. You might have to shift gears. One of the signs in our office that I have... I don't know if it's my quote, I say it all the time, I think I made it up, "Everything that matters needs a system and everything matters, but also make the best decision in the moment." So it sounds confusing, but my team knows exactly what that means. Always collect for this treatment, but if Mrs. Smith's husband is in the hospital, and for some reason she didn't have her chequebook, this is more like from 2010, maybe the best decision in the moment is not to collect at that time. So have systems, but always be willing to adjust if the best decision in the moment asks for that.

0:28:45.6 KD: I love it. I love it so much, Paul. So Paul, if people wanna connect with you, you guys have Dental Nachos, how do people hang out with you more, if they wanna be nicer...

0:28:51.7 PG: I love that. I love hearing from podcasts. I love doing what we're doing here, 'cause they'll say, I heard you on this podcast. The easiest way is to check out our website, dentalnachos.com, and I'm a huge text person, I'm a huge GaryVee fan, so people actually text Nachos to 215-543-6454. We send you a $143 CE gift, that's from Mr. Rogers, his favourite number. I love you, 1-4-3, so you can text Nachos to 215-543-6454, or check out dentalnachos.com.

0:29:18.1 KD: Cool. I love it, Paul. Thank you for sharing that and thanks for sharing with the dentists how it impacts their teams and don't be afraid of it. I think my takeaway from tonight was, just be nicer, just love, just be happy and share that happiness with others, so I appreciate that, Paul. I appreciate you. It's fun, I'm excited to have you at our summit, excited to hang out with you this year. And just grateful for you being a dentist, pushing positivity, 'cause me on a team, I can push it all day long, so I think it's great that you are setting that example for so many dentists out there, so thank you for that.

0:29:48.6 PG: Thanks, Kiera. You're awesome, really appreciate it.

0:29:50.4 KD: Absolutely. Alright, guys. Well, that was Dr. Paul Nacho. [chuckle] And his real name is Dr. Paul Goodman, call him whatever you want, but check him out guys. I think he's got an incredible group of people. Text that number, hang out. Paul and I hang out, we podcast a lot, we webinar a lot, we Facebook Live a lot, so guys, check him out. One of my dearest friends and somebody I just value a ton. And as always guys, thank you for listening, and I'll catch you next time on The Dental A Team Podcast.


0:30:14.4 KD: And that wraps it up for another episode of The Dental A Team Podcast. Thank you so much for listening and we'll talk to you next time.



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